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Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

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Punkal

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Post Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:58 am

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

And there point is that if another company produces a inferior copy of your old supper high quality car and the copy breaks down even though it is 30+ years old it will still look bad for your company.

Its more a image thing for Mercedes not a profit thing. They do not want a inferior copy to negatively influence someone's opinion of there company and the cars the produce.
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Marian87

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Post Sun Mar 25, 2012 12:41 pm

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

You guys just can't seem to understand where I'm coming from with this. Screw the interests of a company that doesn't make that product for 60 years and still holds copyright. As I stated before it shouldn't be allowed to hold the rights to something, in this case the body of a car, for more than 30 years.

It may seem fair to you but not to me.

I'm really fed up of the way copyrights and patents are used these days. The intended use of the these laws was to protect the inventor(a human), for a rather short period of time around 10 years, from someone else copying his creations and profiting instead, not all these shenanigans that go on today with buying, selling, sueing. Corporations in the long run can't be trusted with the responsabability of holding copyrights.

What do guys think of this case? http://consumerist.com/2008/01/ford-photos-of-your-car-are-copyright-infringement.html

For a better understanding of copyright and patents laws work take a look at this series of videos by Kirby Ferguson, Everything is a remix.

Video1: http://vimeo.com/14912890

Video2: http://vimeo.com/19447662

Video3: http://vimeo.com/25380454

Video4: http://vimeo.com/36881035

Enjoy!
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Punkal

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Post Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:53 pm

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

I understand where your coming from and I understand copyright laws, what you are failing to understand is other people are entitled to there own opinion even if it is not the same as yours and you will not change that opinion.

As I started before for Mercedes this is not about that particular car body or profits this is more about the company image... If you create a replica of any of they cars the have produced over the years you will find they will probably do the same thing. They do not want inferior cars with the Mercedes badge on the street because they feel it will negatively impact their company image...
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Marian87

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Post Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:49 pm

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

I highly doubt that replicas cast anything negative on a company's image since it is not a something made by that company at all. I have never see a piece of news saying that hundreds of thousands or millions of replica cars have been recalled to fix such and such or that X company was sued because a replica of one of their cars was faulty or something. The big companys can do worse things to their image all by themselves.

Replicas don't show up on any radar outside of the enthusiast who wants to own something like that.
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Punkal

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Post Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:19 pm

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

I dont know why I am still banging my head against this wall any more...
A broken down replica on the side of the road looks like the car it is replicating not like a broken down replica, that will damage the original manufactures image not the replicas image...
The original manufacturer of any product wants to keep their image as good as it can be and having cheap knock off's (broken down replica on the side of the road) is something they have no control over and I can understand their desire to remove them...
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Marian87

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Post Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:20 pm

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

I dont know why I am still banging my head against this wall any more...


I don't know why I'm doing that either.

I got your point but it's still not valid in the real world. I contend that if you would pit an original 300 SL against a replica one made with modern internals and electrics the replica will be more reliable. Plus it's known that older super cars have a lot of problems and impracticalities attached to them.

Lets take the Lamborghini Miura as an example or the Countach. They weren't the picture of reliability in their day. The Miura could even catch fire.
If those faults in the originals didn't harm the company I fail to see how a replica of that car which is not a 100% the same and most likely uses modern electrics, brakes and so on would do harm if it breaks down.

Look at Jay Lenos site, he has tens and if not hundreds of car mostly original ones. Ther are plenty of them that had design faults from the factory or were limited in the technology used. Why don't the companys close his site because he's soiling their good reliable reputation?
That is ridiculous of course because no one expects modern reliabity from an old car and the only way you can keep or improve your image is to build good cars now. Do you see how this relates to your argument?
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serothis

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Post Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:36 am

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

Marian87 wrote:I got your point but it's still not valid in the real world. I contend that if you would pit an original 300 SL against a replica one made with modern internals and electrics the replica will be more reliable.


What guarantee is there that there will be reliable modern internals? Just because this particular example seems to be done well, What's to stop someone from making cheap knockoffs? "Motorist dies in 300 SL fire" Do you really think a reporter is going to really dig deep to find out if the car was original or a replica?

Yes, older cars have their old and deteriorating systems. But anyone would can afford to buy a 300 SL probably doesn't drive it and if they do probably knows every mechanical issue with their particular car. But then consider this from a collectors point of view. Let's say I want an original 300 SL for sentimental reasons. Now I would have to wade through all of these replicas. And if it's difficult to tell between an original and a replica then yes that does degrade the value. Not just the price tag but the value of the nameplate.
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Post Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:53 am

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

Punkal wrote:I dont know why I am still banging my head against this wall any more...
A broken down replica on the side of the road looks like the car it is replicating not like a broken down replica, that will damage the original manufactures image not the replicas image...
The original manufacturer of any product wants to keep their image as good as it can be and having cheap knock off's (broken down replica on the side of the road) is something they have no control over and I can understand their desire to remove them...


Huh? There are THOUSANDS of replicas of classic Ferraris (most of them based on MR2s - euck) around and nobody crushes them. And even if those are based on kits and assembled by individuals, somebody's still building the kits/has the moulds. It's ridiculous for a company to be so heavy handed with a design they don't even produce any more; if they're worried the SL will suddenly be popular again because some coachmaker decides to build replicas then surely they should be building them?! :roll: Personally, I don't think they SHOULD have any right to the design any more. I'm totally in favour of non-renewable copyrights; they stifle progress and competition for the benefit of a few greedy gits. But then, this is all about corporate greed... Why do we let corporations, who obviously only exist for selfish reasons have so much control over us? It's ridiculous that we value the corporation above the individual these days. (and yes, I realise I live in a country with a Conservative, status-quo maintaining government. Not much I can do about that - the vast majority of the population, myself included, didn't vote for them, but the system is f**ed.)
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Marian87

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Post Mon Mar 26, 2012 1:18 am

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

What guarantee is there that there will be reliable modern internals? Just because this particular example seems to be done well, What's to stop someone from making cheap knockoffs? "Motorist dies in 300 SL fire" Do you really think a reporter is going to really dig deep to find out if the car was original or a replica?


Ok there are no guarantees, but do you think that people didn't die in the original 300 SLs? The worst of the damage has been done already.
What I'm trying to say with that is that the older the car the lesser the impression of responsability is on the company that made it. There are no classic cars being recalled to fix some of their design faults period.
With modern cars you have a period of warranty between 3 and 5 years in which the company is responsible for mechanical and electrical failures after that no one gives a damn unless it is a serious design fault, and that only happens to 10-15 year old cars tops.
This argument of image protection doesn't really stand up. That doesn't mean that Mercedes doesn't think how you do, but it's bullshit reasoning anyway.


Yes, older cars have their old and deteriorating systems. But anyone would can afford to buy a 300 SL probably doesn't drive it and if they do probably knows every mechanical issue with their particular car. But then consider this from a collectors point of view. Let's say I want an original 300 SL for sentimental reasons. Now I would have to wade through all of these replicas. And if it's difficult to tell between an original and a replica then yes that does degrade the value. Not just the price tag but the value of the nameplate.


You would have to wade through replicas only if they were made in very high numbers, rarely the case, and the owners were dihonest and didn't put REPLICA in the title of the add or whatever. Otherwise I don't see a problem here. Look for a 1950s car, phone the guy ask the guy all the important questions and go see the car yourself, have an expert see it etc. You don't buy expensive cars without checking them through.

I would agree with you if replicas were 100% accurate to the original, but when only the body looks the same and it isn't made out of metal then I can't. Plus what is this about value, if you want to buy the original car for sentimental reasons and have a lot of money then the cost doesn't matter. If you want to buy the original car for sentimental reasons and don't have a lot of money then a cheaper replica would be enough.

Lets look at the Shelby Cobra market:
-replicas are worth $50 000 and above
-originals are worth around $2 000 000

The cobra is one the most successful replica car being sold yet the originals are still worth a lot of money. The same goes with the Lotus 7 and Porsche 356. Mercedes is being stupid for not allowing replicas of its old cars. They could allow licensing and make some money from it or sell parts for the replicas.
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Post Sat Apr 14, 2012 9:35 pm

Re: Copyright Insanity? 300 SL destroyed

marian I think you are either too young and/or too naive to understand the copyright & patent laws in play here. Obviously it was considered by the courts as "fair" as Mercedes were allowed to go ahead and destroy the cars. serothis makes many good points that you seem to dismiss with a "who cares about the company" attitude.

If companies weren't guaranteed many of these rights in the first place many of the beautiful cars you see today wouldn't even exist.
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